SHAVING bulldog in keep. (Only reply if you've exp or have knowledge in it.)

[Officially Retired]

With all things being equal except the weight i believe it does equal a 100% success rate.

You are insane to think a 5 oz weight advantage = a 100% success rate.

Do you have the same running score every time?
How about the same weight lift results? Every time?
How about when you play a game? Same score every time?

You have different capabilities each day, hell each hour, and so would your mirror opposite.

To think that the adding of a mere 5 oz would slide the scale to from 50-50 to a 100% success rate is daft, at best, if not insane.

Even if if doesn't it is still an advantage.

A 5 oz advantage

Jack if you were fighting your self with the same training and a 15lb weight advantage that it would be an even matchup?

A 15 lb advantage is significant ... a 48x more significant advantage than a 5 oz advantage ... but even this is not a 100% guarantee of success.

Ever heard of David and Goliath?

It's all about ODDS ... a 5 oz advantage is negligible ... a 15 lb advantage would dramatically change the odds, but yet still not guarantee success.

Jack

[gotap_d]

You are insane to think a 5 oz weight advantage = a 100% success rate.

Do you have the same running score every time?
How about the same weight lift results? Every time?
How about when you play a game? Same score every time?

You have different capabilities each day, hell each hour, and so would your mirror opposite.

To think that the adding of a mere 5 oz would slide the scale to from 50-50 to a 100% success rate is daft, at best, if not insane.





A 5 oz advantage





A 15 lb advantage is significant ... a 48x more significant advantage than a 5 oz advantage ... but even this is not a 100% guarantee of success.

Ever heard of David and Goliath?

It's all about ODDS ... a 5 oz advantage is negligible ... a 15 lb advantage would dramatically change the odds, but yet still not guarantee success.

Jack

Anyone who doesn't think any weight differenve is an advantage with ALL THINGS BEING EQUAL is insane. All things equal if you're 100% your mirror is 100%. If dog A has a slight cold his mirror has a slight cold. Track runner #1 runs a 4 minute mile today his mirror runs a 4 minute mile today.

Your laughing at a 5oz advantage. Thats fine laugh at all the dogmen who take the forfeit and run when the other dog is over 5oz. They must believe they are at a disadvantage.

And i brought up a 15lb difference to illustrate an example using humans not dogs.

Yes i have heard of david and goliath. What does that have to do with what we are talking about? Nothing because they ARE NOT MIRRORS of each other. Two different people with different skill sets and different weapons.

It was a good topic but i think the dead horse is being beaten. I've stated my OPINION and enjoyed the discussion. Thats all i have to say.

[Officially Retired]

Anyone who doesn't think any weight differenve is an advantage with ALL THINGS BEING EQUAL is insane. All things equal if you're 100% your mirror is 100%. If dog A has a slight cold his mirror has a slight cold. Track runner #1 runs a 4 minute mile today his mirror runs a 4 minute mile today.

You don't have the ability to say the same thing twice and keep your thoughts consistent.

You first said you thought a 5 oz advantage was a 100% guarantee of success.

Now you're saying it's "an advantage"

Well, no shit, I already agreed it was an advantage ... a 5 oz advantage

Your laughing at a 5oz advantage. Thats fine laugh at all the dogmen who take the forfeit and run when the other dog is over 5oz. They must believe they are at a disadvantage.

You're, not your.

Just because some dogmen run over 5 oz doesn't mean anything.

Other dogmen push weight and win.

I agree weight matters, when it's significant; we just disagree that 5 oz is "significant."

You also have yet to prove that shaved dog hair = 5 oz, which I doubt very much, so I think "shaving hair" is even less significant.

And i brought up a 15lb difference to illustrate an example using humans not dogs.

In addition to having trouble with concepts, you also have trouble with proportions and math.

15 lb = 48x greater than 5 oz

(1lb = 16 oz x 15 = 240 oz)

240/5 = 48

The average pit dog is 40 lb.
The average human fighter around 160.

This means the average person is 4x the size of the average dog (not 48x the size).
This means you are exaggerating to make a point, so let's bring you back down to reality.

If the average man is 4x the size of the average dog, then you multiply 5 oz x 4 which would = 20 oz (1.25 lb).

This means your big 5 oz "advantage" in a 40 lb bulldog is equal to a 1.25 lb (20 oz) advantage in a middleweight (160 lb) human, which again isn't shit.

Yes i have heard of david and goliath. What does that have to do with what we are talking about? Nothing because they ARE NOT MIRRORS of each other. Two different people with different skill sets and different weapons.

Even the same two people would be different. You are different now from what you were yesterday.

If you played a computer game twice, you would make different choices and get different scores.

As with your lack of understanding of everything else, you're not understanding this concept.

People are not robots who do the same things every time; they are different every single day.

It was a good topic but i think the dead horse is being beaten. I've stated my OPINION and enjoyed the discussion. Thats all i have to say.

Well, it is a good topic, but when you actually THINK about it, and use facts, 1) no one has yet to prove what dog hair weighs, and even if it weighs 5 ounces, which I very much doubt, it still doesn't do shit.

I do agree that weight is significant, when the amount of weight is significant.
But 5 oz isn't shit to a dog (and I still don't think dog hair even weighs 5 oz).

The best middleweight human fighters are not going to win/lose over a 1.25 lb difference in weight, and the best 40 lb dogs are not going to win/lose over 5 oz either.

Other factors will make the difference.

Jack

[gotap_d]

You don't have the ability to say the same thing twice and keep your thoughts consistent.

You first said you thought a 5 oz advantage was a 100% guarantee of success.

Now you're saying it's "an advantage"

Well, no shit, I already agreed it was an advantage ... a 5 oz advantage





You're, not your.

Just because some dogmen run over 5 oz doesn't mean anything.

Other dogmen push weight and win.

I agree weight matters, when it's significant; we just disagree that 5 oz is "significant."

You also have yet to prove that shaved dog hair = 5 oz, which I doubt very much, so I think "shaving hair" is even less significant.





In addition to having trouble with concepts, you also have trouble with proportions and math.

15 lb = 48x greater than 5 oz

(1lb = 16 oz x 15 = 240 oz)

240/5 = 48

The average pit dog is 40 lb.
The average human fighter around 160.

This means the average person is 4x the size of the average dog (not 48x the size).
This means you are exaggerating to make a point, so let's bring you back down to reality.

If the average man is 4x the size of the average dog, then you multiply 5 oz x 4 which would = 20 oz (1.25 lb).

This means your big 5 oz "advantage" in a 40 lb bulldog is equal to a 1.25 lb (20 oz) advantage in a middleweight (160 lb) human, which again isn't shit.





Even the same two people would be different. You are different now from what you were yesterday.

If you played a computer game twice, you would make different choices and get different scores.

As with your lack of understanding of everything else, you're not understanding this concept.

People are not robots who do the same things every time; they are different every single day.





Well, it is a good topic, but when you actually THINK about it, and use facts, 1) no one has yet to prove what dog hair weighs, and even if it weighs 5 ounces, which I very much doubt, it still doesn't do shit.

I do agree that weight is significant, when the amount of weight is significant.
But 5 oz isn't shit to a dog (and I still don't think dog hair even weighs 5 oz).

The best middleweight human fighters are not going to win/lose over a 1.25 lb difference in weight, and the best 40 lb dogs are not going to win/lose over 5 oz either.

Other factors will make the difference.

Jack

Thanks Jack you managed to drag me back in this because of my typo. What the hell does my typo need to be addressed for? If you were going to address my statements in my last post thats all you had to do.

Thanks again for telling me what i first said. But youre WRONG! The first thing i said about the issue of weight difference was post #9. And i said it was a benifit not anything about a 100% guarantee of victory.

I dont need to prove that shaved dog hair weighs 5oz to you. Firstly it was an example in which i threw out a weight. I know all dogs hair weight is different. Since the issue of hair weight is your main concern and not the concept why dont you shave ten 40lb bulldogs from the base of the head down and see if you can get 1oz or less. I can tell you it wont happen. I've shaved enough dogs to know that what you will get will be around what i said in post #8 and that 3-5oz.

Once agin you're nit picking. Im not going to do calculations to to make sure my weight EXAMPLE for a dog is proportional to my weight EXAMPLE of you fighting your clone. I gave the examples and weren't meant to be proportional. You can feel free to come up with your own examples and use adequate proportions if you would like.

So you have complied a list of every fighter in the world and charted their weight and come up with 160 being the average??? My guess would be no(doesn't me pointing that out seem like im nit picking).

Yes pdople are different from day to day but since we are talking about human clones lets assume my EXAMPLE is in a fairy tale world. In this world if its a monday your clone experiences the exact same monday, makes the exact same decisions, feels the exact same way and has the exact same skill set and conditioning. If you two were to do combat with each other the one with the 15lb weight advantage would win.

What do you mean use facts??? I seem to be the ONLY person that posted on this thread, admitting to shaving a dog for the purpose of charting the resuction of weight and saying what those weights were. FACT. All you have been doing is "thinking" you cant get 5oz off a dog and "guessing" that the hair is less than 1oz. Once again it is pointless to prove how much dog hair weighs. It doesn't matter how much "dog hair" weighs as long as i know how much my current dog that i am bringing to the box lost when he is shaved and i can adjust the feed/fluid intake accordingly. I agree with you on one thing 5oz of hair is not significant just like its not significant if you take you bring your natural 40m otc and go into a 43lb dog that is a natural 37m. Yea you pushed 3lbs but it was against a dog that is naturally 3lbs smaller than your dog. Im not arguing shave your dog to have a 5oz(example #) weight advantage on the scale.

In the end, a relaxed, poised dog, in shape, and with good blood, will be long-winded with the hair God gave it.

Jack

PS: Can't think of a single all-time-great dog that needed to be matched, shaved

If you think wind is the only conditioning factor involved in going the long haul you're mistaken. There are people that get in deep water and never take a breath but still lose because of the keep because of things like muscle endurance. Their dogs legs will begin to wobble and you can watch the keep fall off right before your eyes. My stance on the main topic that i'm arguing has and will continue to be the same. If I can shave my dog, take 5oz of hair off and put 5oz more of fuel(feed/fluid) in him to maybe give him an advantage over the other dog in the long haul i will do it every single time. The hair sure isn't helping keep him on his feet in deep water. Will it make me win no but i'm going to help my dog succeed as much as possible.

PS: I cant either. I also cant think of any all-time great that needed to go through a full keep to beat some of thier opponents, or needed to be shot with steroids or travel several states over to train in the same altitude as their opponent but that didnt stop their conditioners from doing it and believing it was an advantage that would help their dog.

Thanks again Jack for the convo but I'm done regardless of you pointing out spelling/grammar errors or not.

[Officially Retired]

Blah-blah-blah ...

I was not wrong about anything.

You said dog hair weighs 5 oz but have no evidence to support this.

I said I do not believe shaved bulldog hair would weigh even that.

Even if it did, I said 5 oz isn't shit and affects nothing.

In post #32 of this thread, you said, if two equals faced each other, the one with the 5 oz wight advantage would win "100% of the time," which is laughable.

With all things being equal except the weight i believe it does equal a 100% success rate.

Now, you're denying saying this, which not only makes you laughably-wrong, but a dishonest liar, even when your own words have been posted here for all to see.

You then attempted to compare a 5 oz weight advantage in dogs to a 15-lb weight advantage in humans (also on post #32 of this thread):

Jack if you were fighting your self with the same training and a 15lb weight advantage that it would be an even matchup?

I am not "nitpicking" for pointing out the fact your comparison is invalid ... the truth is your comparison WAS SO FAR OFF it simply demanded correction, as 15 lb is 48x more weight than 5 oz.

I correctly pointed out THE FACT that humans are, in general, only 4x bigger than dogs, and here is my PROOF:

The lowest weight male dog I know of being matched is 26 lb, which when multiplied x4 = 104 lb.
Coincidentally, the lowest human fight division is Mini Flyweight, which limit is 105 lb, exactly 4x greater.

The largest legit match dogs I know of being matched are 59-60 lb, pit weight, which when multiplied x4 = 240 lb.
Coincidentally, the HIGHEST you will EVER see truly competitive boxers fight at as Heavyweights will never exceed this amount either, which again is exactly 4x the weight of the largest, legit Catch Dogs.

Therefore, as stated, humans are about 4x the size of pit bulls, and this is true from the smallest to the biggest. I simply picked a 40 lb "middleweight" bulldog, and compared it to a 160 lb middleweight human fighter, but (as demonstrated) the truth of what I said obtains across the board, from the smallest to the lightest: the 4x ratio applies.

Therefore, you trying to compare a 5 oz advantage in a dog to a 15 lb advantage in a human fighter (a 48x greater disparity, not 4x), was SO FAR OFF that I had to correct the amazing stupidity/cluelessness of your opinion, and point out THE FACT that 5 oz in a 40 lb dog translates to 20 oz (1.25 lb) in a middleweight 160 lb human fighter (using the universally-true 4x standard).

Smaller bulldogs will have less hair, larger bulldogs will have more hair, but THE RATIO will remain the same

I merely tried to screw your head on correctly, but you are resistant to reality. I then showed you how ridiculous your argument is, using real numbers.

With the real numbers in place, and with a realistic sense of proportion used (1.25 lb), if you are still trying to suggest that a 160 lb middleweight has "an advantage" over a 158.75 lb middleweight, then yes, I am calling you an idiot. It is a negligible, nothing weight disparity in the middleweight division ... and, when scaled-down 1/4 to 40 lb bulldogs, I am saying that a 5 oz weight advantage of a 40 lb dog over a 39.7 lb dog (the proportional equivalent), is likewise a negligible, nothing weight disparity as well.

You can "deny" this all you want, but denial isn't rebuttal, it is only denial

Everything you have said so far has been false, exaggerated, and has indicated a total misunderstanding of basically every single concept that is possible to talk about as it pertains to this subject. I am trying to keep things REAL, with real numbers, accurate proportions, and sound concepts ... while you invent pure, fabricated bullshit out of thin air, grossly exaggerate, and then deny the silliness of the things you've said previously.

At the end of the day, what *I* have said is the truth:

A 160 lb middleweight has no appreciable advantage over a 158.75-lb middleweight, and no sane fight analyst/trainer would think so either.
And likewise, a 40 lb bulldog has no appreciable advantage over a 39.7 lb bulldog, and no sane dogman would think so either.

As I have said repeatedly (as well as some of the others), Other Factors are going to be the determining causes of who wins/loses, not the negligible weight difference

Again, you can "deny" this if you want, but denial isn't rebuttal, it is only denial.

Jack