gameness

[OGDOGG]

They both scratched to a doa dog at the same age. But you're right he was always the top dog and hasn't been put under pressure like his brother. He pretty much blew through everything.
But then I factor in his traits. He is off (SuperStar/Ch Blonka) both parents were out of high percentage litters themselves. From what I've seen in him and from my knowledge of both families, since I have 2 siblings in SuperStar and Little Secret(both tested game) and 3 siblings in Ch Blonka, Ch Buddy and BullsEye(stolen)who had high abilities, into the equation, I think highly of his gameness.

[Officially Retired]

They both scratched to a doa dog at the same age. But you're right he was always the top dog and hasn't been put under pressure like his brother. He pretty much blew through everything.

Scratching into a dead dogs confuses a lot of people. The truth is the desire to do this has nothing to do with gameness, only finish. Gameness is the will to persevere no matter what ... ability never to lose one's confidence or drive while things are going rough ... so only one of your dogs is proven game ... while both are proven finishers.

Regarding scratching into dead dogs, I do not agree with this practice for two primary reasons: 1) it is not required to scratch into dead dogs in a match, so a dog doesn't really need this trait in order to win, and 2) many of those "dead dogs" that are killed in the box are (I am sure) the very game plugs we are talking about. So, to me, this is an abuse of dogs that fills no purpose. I have been able to produce more truly DG dogs than most breeders without ever killing another dog ...

The truth is anyone can tell if a dog is truly game (or a finisher), without actually killing another dog, same as anyone can tell if a man is willing to continue (or going to be choked out) in MMA without actually seeing him die ...

But then I factor in his traits. He is off (SuperStar/Ch Blonka) both parents were out of high percentage litters themselves. From what I've seen in him and from my knowledge of both families, since I have 2 siblings in SuperStar and Little Secret(both tested game) and 3 siblings in Ch Blonka, Ch Buddy and BullsEye(stolen)who had high abilities, into the equation, I think highly of his gameness.

I totally agree with you in that it always seems more desirable to breed to the more talented brother ... but it doesn't always prove to be the way to go. Still, it sure does make logical sense. Trouble is, prepotency doesn't always follow logic

I have to say that I too would probably breed to the more talented of two littermates, it is just hard to breed to a dog with less ability, but if the gameness is EXTREME (the kind you can just feel when you see it), then I would give that dog a shot.

Regarding Ch Blonka, didn't she herself pretty much prove the point about the value gameness when she was stopped by Ch Rose Red? Blonka beat the bejesus out of Red, but stood the line. Please forgive me if I am mistaken, but that is what I seem to recall. Maybe breeding Blonka (with her high ability) to SuperStar (with high gameness) will give you a complete dog, but I would rather breed SuperStar to Rose Red, the bitch who beat Blonka on gameness.

Jack

[OGDOGG]

Totally agree with this.

Regarding Ch Blonka, didn't she herself pretty much prove the point about the value gameness when she was stopped by Ch Rose Red? Blonka beat the bejesus out of Red, but stood the line. Please forgive me if I am mistaken, but that is what I seem to recall. Maybe breeding Blonka (with her high ability) to SuperStar (with high gameness) will give you a complete dog, but I would rather breed SuperStar to Rose Red, the bitch who beat Blonka on gameness.

Jack

I couldn't agree more on everything you just said as far as gameness and finishing skills. And you are right about Gr Ch Rose Red stopping her after she almost killed RR. There are no excuses from me whatsoever because I did not owned Blonka at the time and I didn't condition her. Both of my old partners dogs ran hot at the :20 mark and couldn't recover to the end. A knowledgeable dogman knows that no matter how game a dog is, they will all stop after they run hot and can't recover. Well, except for my ex partner. She got counted out but trust me she did not quit. Like RR's owner reported in the journal "when it was Blonka's turn to scratched, i tucked RR in real tight and made sure she didnt move, then Blonka got counted out and we screamed and yell like we won the final four!" what he didn't mentioned was that Blonka scratched once she saw where RR was.
At one time I offered to buy Blonka for 5K when she was a 2xer, but he refused to sell her to me. Then once she lost, I picked up his trash and turned her into a Champ.

[Officially Retired]

I couldn't agree more on everything you just said as far as gameness and finishing skills. And you are right about Gr Ch Rose Red stopping her after she almost killed RR. There are no excuses from me whatsoever because I did not owned Blonka at the time and I didn't condition her. Both of my old partners dogs ran hot at the :20 mark and couldn't recover to the end. A knowledgeable dogman knows that no matter how game a dog is, they will all stop after they run hot and can't recover.

Great point.

Well, except for my ex partner. She got counted out but trust me she did not quit. Like RR's owner reported in the journal "when it was Blonka's turn to scratched, i tucked RR in real tight and made sure she didnt move, then Blonka got counted out and we screamed and yell like we won the final four!" what he didn't mentioned was that Blonka scratched once she saw where RR was.

Thank you for telling the whole story ...

At one time I offered to buy Blonka for 5K when she was a 2xer, but he refused to sell her to me. Then once she lost, I picked up his trash and turned her into a Champ.

Good for you. This is where opinions vary and "one man's trash becomes another man's treasure." Evo himself conceded that he once lost to a dog he got rid of.

Certainly, if Ch Blonka has that kind of ability ... and only stopped at the point of absolute fatigue ... she is worthy of a shot. Ch Nico (4xW, 1xL) lost to Gr Ch IBM ... but he out-produced IBM by a landslide.

So, my bad if Blonka's conditioning is what caused her the loss.

Jack

[FarmersChoice]

Great point.





Thank you for telling the whole story ...





Good for you. This is where opinions vary and "one man's trash becomes another man's treasure." Evo himself conceded that he once lost to a dog he got rid of.

Certainly, if Ch Blonka has that kind of ability ... and only stopped at the point of absolute fatigue ... she is worthy of a shot. Ch Nico (4xW, 1xL) lost to Gr Ch IBM ... but he out-produced IBM by a landslide.

So, my bad if Blonka's conditioning is what caused her the loss.

Jack

this were breeding programs can very makes u really scratch your head sometimes

[Ez Country]

Breed for gameness the rest will come. If bred right those game plugs will produce you some of your best dogs. Ez's Tarzan was a game dog with no mouth he did have some talent as he would fight the throat and stay out of trouble. First litter he produced a 1xw1xlq, two others were f'd off. Second litter he produced 3 males all are bet worthy have seen 2 of em show some finish, 1 of which might be an Ace. Third litter is only 11 months old and are looking and acting killer