I been out of the "Game/ Loop" for a few years now. Upon my return I've noticed a lot of dogs that are performing well seem to be heavy outcrosses or at best very loose line breedings... Dog Like Gr Ch Buk Buk , Gr Ch Hulk. Are these outliers or is there a trend? I was always accustomed to line breeding or outcrosses back to a line to create 3/4 -1/4 crosses... Interested in hearing some opinions
I used, will use and have always used what works when keeping a family of dogs working.Originally Posted by 1DEEP
I like to keep a family of dogs in the traditional aspect sort of speak rather than just throwing mud against the wall and see what sticks,
You can add to but don't take away from.
I have always used this same method since the start of my family of dogs to currently and planned future. The 3/4 with 1/4 out.
This is how I have woven different families together into a single family. Just as the same formula as the Fibonacci sequence = the sum of the 1st 2 numbers equals the next number, so do I line breed on a good dog or cross from the breeding 3/4 and the 1/4 out.
I don't just focus on 1 side of the ped nor just 1 dog so I may also have 3/4 of the opposite side using 1/4 of the good dog as the out. But you just don't stop there.
You have to weave that back into the family again and recreate a new 3/4 in with 1/4 out.
As most family bred dogs based on the same good dog top and bottom, I use different ways to always keep the same topside generation after generation.
Examples using my own dogs and line breeding 3/4 with 1/4 out over and over.
This is an upcoming breeding this year. http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...3&dam_id=93906
This is a tighter version of the same father Black Dragon, 3/4 my bloodline with 1/4 out. the female Abby. http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=90160
. The male that will be bred is 3/4 of Dragons top side with 1/4 of Dragon bottom side http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=93903 and he will be bred to a female that is 3/4 of Dragons bottom side with 1/4 of dragon's topside. http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=93906 .
Black Dragons father, Mister Oxxx is a 3/4 Hicks dog (Uncle-Niece) with 1/4 of White blend as an out. http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=87656 .
and the same as the 2 belly mates. Those 2 belly mates were bred in the past the same way the upcoming breed were.
They were a tighter version of a good litter prior to them. One of the dogs being this dog http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=55941 .
The breeding was 3/4 of the topside http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=62785 bred back to 3/4 of the bottom side http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=62786 based on 2 good belly mates from a good litter. Mango being 1 of the belly mates Mr Reckelss is just a tighter version of Mango.
We can go on and on further and further back, but I have used this in other branches also of my family of dogs not just these dogs.
I have no problem using the 3/4 and 1/4 dogs, but I keep them going past that point also.
I might have left Reckless out http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=69536 that's a tighter version on Mango http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=55941 and also point out that Red Johnie Mother Options is also 3/4 Mr Reckless breeding with 1/4 white Oak out http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...p?dog_id=90830 .
Yes I still go with the 3/4 in and 1/4 out. Have even more than just those .
I think it not only depends on the family, but the individual strain. Some families can be bred heavier than others and some strains within that family need the influx of the cross.
I have been a Mims fan since the 80's. Mr. Mims was right down the road and puppies were really cheap, in comparison to others over the years. There was no need to breed my own dogs, or even fancy myself as a breeder, with the source 30 minutes down the road and I could buy two-three-four puppies for what one cost elsewhere.
The best dogs I ever seen were his 50-25/25 blends, and the ones that I saw work best were 50% Red Boy-25% Snooty/25% Bolio. What we also found is that we could not duplicate his successes by breeding his dogs. Mostly, he was a second generation dog man with 60+ years of breeding game dogs.
What we did find was we could breed a Mims dog to another family and have really good success. What we found was that it was better to take that cross back to Mims vs. breeding toward the cross. The breedings we made were usually Mims to an out, back to Mims, back to an out, and back to Mims.
Over time the dogs got better for us, but the pedigrees "look scatter bred" at first but if tracing the family (Mims) back and forth the pattern arises.
One example is we bred a Garner male (Kronos/Frisco) to a Mims female (Spiffy/Lucky) and had 7 puppies with six being matched with several camps stretching from Florida to New Jersey. The 7th puppy was maybe the best of the litter but knocked his teeth out around 18-20 months. When we bred back toward the Garner family (Kronos/Frisco) the percentages were low, got one absolute monster, but the rest were not much to write home about. When those same dogs were bred back toward Mims we got more match dogs. But again, the pedigrees started to look 'all over the place'.
great topic. Enjoy reading the pedigrees and trying to follow the patterns.
Scott
http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum...0&dam_id=96945
And then this is pretty much a 50/50 breeding, Bolio-Eli but there is a shot of Red Boy in the back.
I guess time will tell.
EWO
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