Quote Originally Posted by APBT
Thank you Mr. Koerner and to all the advice I received from everyone. I decided It is best to not post a video of the dog in order to protect the breeder’s reputation, my dog’s reputation, and my dog’s ancestors reputation. Everyone has their opinion and there is no way of changing people’s opinion. It is very difficult to convince someone to think a certain way if they do not want to. I have tried before, but it is almost impossible. Having said that I feel I must defend Human aggresive dogs. The words “human aggressive” explain the result but not the catalyst of what caused the human aggression in the first place. A better phrase to identify a dog that exhibits aggression towards humans could be reffered to as an “insecure dog” that when provoked either bites, growls, barks or runs away. In this forum we are talking about the ones that bite when they are provoked. A human can “provoke” an insecure dog in ways that would seem harmless in the human’s eyes, however through the dog’s eyes they are doing something that poses a threat.
You're welcome for the advice, and I am sorry you paid no attention to the good advice given you. I do not have the time, nor the inclination any longer, to write too much about this topic again, as everything I could possibly say has pretty much already been said.

I will say I agree with your premise that it is impossible to change most people's opinion, as you provide a classic example of this. Where we disagree is on the level of expertise that is in back of different people's opinions, which thereby has to do with the accuracy of two opinions as they differ and relate to a subject. If you think that "you" (as a beginner who doesn't really understand what he's talking about), are going to change "my" opinion (as a man who's been around thousands of these dogs, and who literally "wrote the book" on this breed), that's a pretty high esteem you have for your green opinion. Unfortunately, sticking to your beliefs, even in the face of expert advice, while it may be the sign of a strong will, can also be a will to stupidity.

Your description of a man killer as being "insecure" is way off. What you are describing is a fear-biter, and they are not the same. A true man-killer (as I said, and you ignored) goes after people with the same zeal and intensity as it would another dog. What you described of your puppy is nothing compared to that, and is more akin to a fear biter and a dog that is not very intelligent. The description you gave of your handling of the puppy and the situation is basically beginner dog handling and the kind of thing all new owners go through with this breed. What you described about his lashing out at your family again sounds more like fear-biting, or a moody unpredictable dog, which is still an undesirable trait in an APBT. You simply haven't seen/owned far superior dogs to your pup to be able to see him for the unsuitable, inferior-tempered specimen he is.

However, since you refuse to show an actual video of your pup, there is no further we can go and no qualified "second opinion" can be given. I do not understand your unwillingness to show the video, as there is no way anyone can guess who the breeder is nor "who his ancestors are," neither of which holds any interest to me (nor, I am sure, for anyone else) either. The whole point of this thread being started, I thought, was to help you make a decision; it was originally created by you to get an expert opinion as to "what you should do" with your dog. But since you refuse to provide enough information (namely, a video so we can see), and particularly since it sounds like your mind was actually already made up from the start, there seems no point in prolonging the discussion.

I will say that what you went on and on about, regarding wild animals, has ZERO relevance to a discussion of what it takes to be a "house dog," as dogs are supposed to be domesticated animals, not wild ones, and as such are judged precisely by their suitability as happy, loving domesticated animals. The minor footnote as to "why" your dog lashes out and attacks, is not as important as the fact it does lash out. The very fact your dog does this means it is unsuitable as house dog, and your judgment to keep it anyway (because of some bizarre idea that a dog you got from someone else is "part of your family") is yours and yours alone to make. I personally don't "bond" to anything, unless it proves itself worthy of being bonded with. To form a "bond" with some poorly-tempered dog, just because it is "yours," at the expense of your family's safety (especially when there are thousands of friendlier alternatives) seems a dubious selection at best. The success or failure of any undertaking hinges on selection, and a wiser choice would be to select a better dog to make as part of your family, because there are plenty of "better dogs" to choose from than an insecure fear-biter. The truth is, everything you said about dogs that "haven't been socialized" becoming fearful is only true for lesser dogs, because I have seen (owned, bred, and raised) THOUSANDS of chain dogs that are perfectly friendly the very first time time they come into the house as totally-unsocialized adults, let alone pups, that would NEVER lash-out at a person. Therefore, your beliefs in regards to your pup are simply ignorant and based on no actual experience dealing with HUNDREDS of "unsocialized" bulldogs. Your pup doesn't act like this because he's unsocialized; he acts like this because he has an inferior temperament that may or may not have been socialized.

In the end, what you're doing is "inventing ideas" in your head, and you really aren't looking for "expert advice" at all, since in point of fact you've flatly ignored all the expert advice given, by several different knowledgeable dogmen, as per the first paragraph of your post. The truth is, what you're doing is looking for is everyone here to "agree with what you're doing," and you are hoping for us all to "commend you for what you're deciding," but you're not honestly looking to follow any actual advice if it differs from what you've already decided. I am sorry to say, but you're not going to get that kind of approval here, at least not from me, because I absolutely disagree with anyone selecting a man-biter (or even a fear-biter, as what it sounds like you have) for a house dog. Either temperament disorder represents inferior characteristics of what a true bulldog is supposed to have, in any case, let alone as a house dog. As mentioned, the success or failure of any effort all hinges on selection, and I personally (and anyone truly knowledgeable, not to mention anyone with even a lick of sense) would select a better dog to be around a family, and there are plenty of them to choose from.

Good luck though,

Jack

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