So many of the new comers and undesirables who've been around awhile are trying to get it easy and underhandedly. We have been getting ours the hard way for years.... and have never been able to make Grand Champion, for one reason or another. I've had 4- 4xw's, 4- 3xw's, and countless other winners; all the old fashion way.... between the boards. Get it how the real doggers get it!