Ok 1st off I am Williams and thanks for the reponse but yall did not answer the ? any real dog man knows that just because you have not heard of a few dogs in the 1st 2 gen means nothing but that you have not hear of them?? That's it!! 65 peps have viewed the thread and I got 3 reply tell me stuff I know no one has the cross but me!!that why I put 8 gen for the sire 8 for the dam for real dog men to give there opinion of the cross THAT'S IT!! Real simple unless u can not read a ped then I understand. And who care bout the bully site look on this data base or Feds online if u want