That's great info TFX. Seems you have alot of knowledge on Garner dogs. Real knowledge not just hear say or looking at a ped. I do know the Little Gator stuff...Like 4x Black Angel and 1x Joe black are some good dogs. Just not sure how they are as producers. Of course this are BMW's dogs though. Tom really likes that bitch Pew and Pew 2. He uses them often in his program. So far my pup is looking good. But to young to tell Right now I'm gathering as much info as I can on his heritage. I've never ran Chinaman dogs before. The last of my yard got old died on me and I was always a fan of Chinaman himself so I decided to try a new line. Before I ran stuff down from Gr Ch Art...Eli Carver blends and some OFRN stuff.