THE IMPORTANCE OF A BOND BETWEEN MAN & DOG (Yes / No)

[Officially Retired]

I guess I'll finally get in this conversation for a piece or two.
First I'd like to say that bonds are not VITAL to success. As I've said many times, I do think they can play a part in a small number of dogs, but overall, it's not vital to success.

My own vote is that a bond may (or may not) have an impact on success. I can think of certain dogs that didn't give a damn whose hands they were in, they were going out there to kick ass regardless. I can think of other dogs who, even in the hands of the most loving of owners, were going to quit (if the going got rough) regardless. However, between these two extremes, I can also think of several dogs who, in one man's hands, would NOT perform at the same level as they would when in their true owner's hands ... and these particular dogs were absolutely outstanding animals too, not average. Thus I think the formation of a bond is helpful to the best and most intelligent of GAME dogs ... while a bond is not really necessary for GAME dogs that aren't too bright.

I would like to say that I know, over the years, there have been some dogs I've bonded with, but there have been countless others I have not. I can't sit here and honestly say that I've ever felt like it made a difference or not. So this nonsense about not being man enough along with whatever other hogwash was said in that particular vein is just that, nonsense. I've cried over dogs that have never won when they died. I've cried over dogs that did win and passed on. Hell, I've cried at pretty much everything at one point or another, because I'm the exact opposite of what bolero says. I'm about the most emotional person I know in regards to most everything.

I am not sure if you 'having' emotions has to do with your will to extend those emotions/effort towards a bond. I actually think the emotions of making the effort to bond, only to be disappointed later, is one of the primary reasons many owners stop trying to get attached to their dogs--it hurts when you get attached to the wrong dog ...

I will only talk about what I've seen personally. I've known a lot of men in my time in dogs that never developed any kind of bond with their dogs aside from whatever is formed by feeding/taking care of them. One of the owners of Hunter Red never did anything for his dogs but feed, work, and put them back out. His litters of pups were born on the chain spot. The dogs were a means to an end. He won a lot more than he lost. He bred some dogs that went on to form their own line of dogs, and he is but one example of many I can think of that didn't go out of their way to form any bond, and it was never vital to his success.

I think I know the person of whom you are speaking. And I agree that people can "win matches" without forming a bond with their dogs ... but it seems like an awful lot of the greatest dogs have someone do more than just throw food at them and work them. I think people who just throw food at their dogs, and fight them, seldom (if ever) have a truly great dog. I think in order to maximize a dog's potential, it's natural intelligence and affection for people need to be developed also.

Most of the dogs I've used over the years are such nutters that bonds simply aren't something you form with them. You could spend all day, every day, with Smiley and she wouldn't care who you were when it came time to do her thing. I know because I did, and she won without me being there with someone she barely knew. Maybe it's the type of dog I have; I don't know. I have never seen a bond make a dog scratch when it normally wouldn't have. I've seen men use their house dogs, hell, I saw one man use his SON'S dog, with his son there, and it made zero difference.

We both know an old man who does not form a bond with his dogs. And, in point of fact, his dogs (likewise) were "nutters" ... those were the only kinds of dog who could make it on his loveless yard. But the flipside is, most of that man's dogs were nothing special ... just extremely game retards with no intelligence (for the most part). Every single great dog that man had was bred by someone else and BOUGHT by him at pitside ... he never had a truly great dog that he bred, raised, and groomed himself. Why? Because forming a bond and socializing a dog is part of what it (usually) takes for a dog to be truly great IMO.

I certainly don't fault someone who attempts to do everything within their power to have an edge, I just have never seen that type of "edge" factor into play. Or maybe it did factor in and no one knew. Either way, it made no difference in the outcome of the contest.

There is no doubt IMO that forming a bond and socializing with the right dog will give a person an edge ... whereas forming a bond with and socializing the wrong dog can break your heart.

As a side note, it is a contradiction to say, "Or maybe it did factor in and no one knew. Either way, it made no difference in the outcome of the contest." Logically-speaking, if a bond factored in, then it made a difference

One time, many years ago, I owned a dog that wouldn't do anything in a box without me being there. She wouldn't start; she wouldn't run; she wouldn't do anything. She was a one owner dog, and I was the one owner. In the end, she still quit in under 40 minutes.

Well, the way I see it is that your bond with that dog made 40 minutes' worth of difference ... so just imagine what a bond with a truly great dog could do

So yes, bonds are an intangible thing that are hard to quantify so there's no way to accurately say, in fact, that it helps at all. I disagree with the pole in that it's vital to success, as I stated earlier, when it's simply not vital at all.

Well, you're entitled to be a member of The 1% Club ... and I agree that a bond is an intangible factor.

I myself am a member of The 24% Club in this case ... as I agree that a bond is not 'always' vital ... but I do think it sure as hell can be ... if bestowed upon the right dog ... and if he ever gets deep in the trenches with his equal, who does not have such a bond, or visa versa.

That said, because the effort to form a bond will never hurt any dog, and can only help it, that it can only be considered "best practice" to attempt to form a bond with any combat dog. Again, the trouble is, IMO, that because the effort to form such a bond may well in fact hurt the owner ... if his dog doesn't do well ...that many people stop taking the time and making the effort to do so ... because they are the ones who don't want to be hurt in the end (either that, or because they don't really have the capacity to form a bond themselves).

Jack