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I have been wondering if a dogs ability to keep a hold longer has to do with bite wotk or just with the dogs wind (stamina condition), I ask this because as I have been working out my dog he has been able to keep a hold, way longer than before when I give him some tugging play. Yet all I do for his work out is walking, running and sprinting, I only give him some tugging play every once in a while.
Would like to see your opinions.
Jon
It depends on the dog. Some like to hold, some like to bite and release. The ones that bite and release in my opinion are the hard biters. Although some holders do have hard bites, it won't do as much damage as bite and release and it also won't help if they don't shake either.
But as for your question, yes it will help the mouth doing both running and mouth work.
You could work the dogs mouth the first couple weeks of the keep, stop, and just run him, and during those last few weeks of the keep, his mouth will still be just as good or better come show time.
Having a holding dog could be your best bet if he's holding the right spot or it could be his own demise. What I mean by that is they could tire out the hog and then kill him with a good hold. But also if he's not letting go and if it goes the distance and you can't make a handle due to him still having a hold, his chances of surviving will dramatically decrease. Know your dog's weakness and his strength and help him during his keep.
Example 1: let's say I have a bitch who I've seen finish a hog in :30. I also know that she doesn't have a hard bite but she has that drive to finish and she could hold a hog down for as long as she want. Now that I know all this, for her next keep I will work on her mouth throughout the keep to help her keep her holds. She can't over work her mouth because she had no mouth to begin with.
Example 2: if I have a hard biting bitch, I will work her mouth during the off season(before I lock her) once she's lock, I'll stop all mouth work during the keep. This is just to make sure I don't work the mouth out of her. All the exercises she's getting during her keep are enough to keep her mouth stay strong.
imo it will never improve the bite, but if you train the muscles they wont "acidify" or later. as said stop the mouthwork 2-3 weeks before you want them to put in action
That is exactly what mouth work is for: to increase the long-term endurance of the jaw muscles. It will not make a dog bite harder.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon P. Lebron
Think about boxing: a boxer is either a puncher, or he is not a puncher, because no amount of training is going to turn a feather-fisted man into a slugger. KO punchers are born, they're not made. By training, sparring, and hitting the bag all a boxer is doing is increasing his muscular stamina ... his ability to stay in the fight, keep his hands up, and keep punching ... to within whatever power limit his genetics have determined ...
And in exactly the same fashion, bite work will work a dog's jaw muscles ... and increase the dog's ability to KEEP BITING ... within whatever "hardness" limit his genetics have determined.
Jack
Thank for your opinion, I guess I will be giving my dog a bit more of bite work.
So bite work would teach a dog to breath with it's mouth closed?
You see back in P.R. I had a bitch (she was the family pet) and all I gave her was bite work. I had a wheel barrel tire hanging from a tree from which she would hang. Now when ever I played with her she would not let go of the rag, she would release only to get a better hold of it, any way I can remember that as she would get tired she would be huffing and puffing with her mouth closed and wouldn't let go. Would this be the result of her bite work with the wheel barrel tire?
I have always felt that was my only real benefit of any mouthwork.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon P. Lebron
often when you first put a dog on a springpole, his jaw area will start shaking when u get him off.
muscles, that can be trained ^^
jmo
Completely agree with you, also some dogs jaw will shake and the dog will start to loose it's grip, when you first give them bite work. But as time pases and you give them more bite work this stops happening, I guess it's jaw muscle is being worked out, like Jack said, it's the equivalent of a boxer hitting the bag.Quote:
Originally Posted by R2L
I give mine knuckle bones
If done correctly, yes, absolutely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon P. Lebron
Any suggestions on how to give a dog bite work properly.Quote:
Originally Posted by CA Jack
My dad use to work in a restaurant and he would bring my dogs some big ham bones, they loved it. Don't know how much it did for their jaw but I guess it had to do something because those bones where hard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nextlevel
if one were to use a scale of 1 to 10 with 1 being a cotton mouth dog and ten being an all out freak it kinda sorta works like this. If dog A is biting on a 6 there is nothing one can really do to make him bite like an 8 or 9, and 10 would be a pipe dream. The intent would be to make sure you maintain the 6 by not over working or coming off jaw work too late in the keep. The idea is to make sure he is conditioned to be a 6 an hour in or even later. If the conditioning fades the mouth will fade as well. EWO
Ok, the question now arises, if a dog is well conditioned yet no bite work was given to it will it be able to keep it's bite at the same intensity through out a long contest?
I would think it would hinder the dog feom keeping it's bite intensity even tho he is well conditioned.
Flirt pole with a hide.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon P. Lebron
I got a flirt pole but it doesn't have a hide attached to it, this might sound stupid to ask but where can I find a hide. I've never used hide for bite work, always used tires especially wheel barrel tires.Quote:
Originally Posted by OGDOGG
Overtyme Kennels Supplies usually has hides availalble. And Stillwater has them from time to time. My flirtpole is a pcv pipe with rope and the end. At the end of the rope is frayed with a knot. He goes crazy of it. I have tried hide too but he doesn't seem to be a fan of it as much as with the frayed rope.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon P. Lebron
I use a kong toy for all my contraptions. Flirt pole, spring pole, sling pole, jenny, etc. I start all of mine off playing with kongs when they're pups, so they ALL love kong toys.
What's a sling pole?Quote:
Originally Posted by FrostyPaws
Big hard bones are not on my list, teeth do get damaged. Just a thought.
If you have a rag,toy ,or lite toy that the dog likes try walking or running the dog with the toy in his mouth this will help with teaching them to breate in hold.
He does this by him self, in every walk he grabs a stick from the ground and walks with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by widerange
Ok my firsty post here..It is my belive that you can NOT improve a dogs biting powerd. nor teach him to holding on longer..many factors and diferend sircumstanses make ore break holds of a dog.. Most of the hard biting dogs bite hard in the beginning and there jaw muscles tire out QUIK. as the jaw muscle is one if not the shortest muscle in the dogs Body. and as some of you know, short muscle generaly give more strenght , but tire out very quik as wel... as it is a dog is born with a hard mouth ore not. just like a knockout punsh of a fighter. teaching a dog to hold his holds is frutless and makes no sense at al using training techniks. as holding ON is compleatly stamina/ conditioned geneticly related. As soon as a dog runns hot he starts to gasp!! and releases its holds.
However there are dogs that are not hard mouthed dogs that DO hold there holds loner. but this is also geneticly detirmend. I prefeur a holding dog over a hard mouthed dog 365 days a year!!. simply because a hard mouthed dog tires his muscles eurly on.
Ofthen a dog that is labeld as a hard mouthed dog is ofthen confused with a dog that has good holds and works them out properly!!.as mentiond above YOU CAN teachs a dog from puppy hood to work on the lease (harnas) holding a stuft play toy in its mouth . ofthen this works better with bitches then with males.
this way you DO teachs them to breath tru there nose!! al the time and when getting hotter. But that thussend automaticly makes your dog a holding dog when matured.. giving dogs bones is tricky as wel dont over do it and dont give them big bones. teeth do wear out. i prefeur to give them small dried cow hide bones that wil last no longer then 20 min i give them ones a week when working a dog and on its rest day.... Again bitng endurance is stamina and genetic related.....Longest holdshow we saw lasted 1.01 min and the show lasted 1.01 min .
.
From what you say, the bitch I had back in P.R. (the one in my avatar) was able to hold on to the tire or anything I gave her to bite because of her genetics, because I really didn't walk her or took her for runs, she was not in condition. When I did take her to the park she would get tired quickly, but you showed her a rag and she wouldn't let go, she would lay on the ground tired as hell but she would be huffing and puffing through the sides of her mouth.Quote:
Originally Posted by Limey Kennels
I agree made the mistake of leaving a cows leg bone with one of my dogs, who loves to chew, those kong things only last a day with her,anyway a broke canine was the result. Won't be making that mistake again.....Quote:
Originally Posted by tasoschatz